Should I do it.........?

[Mac Romans]

ok, I'm after some advice and I've tagged in various names of folk who may be able to shed some light. My car has had every cosmetic part and a lot of mechanical parts upgraded, but it's still got the (perfectly adequate and fun) 3.0ltr engine.

Now, a friend of mine has a beautifully maintained M3 which he is doing some serious stuff to (drilled out the spot welds to remove the roof and fitted a custom full carbon fibre unit) as he does not do things by half. He has got himself an M5 and is soon to start an engine conversion so he'll be running the V10 in his M3.

This in turn means that his M3 engine, gearbox and wiring loom are soon to become available and at a very attractive price to me.

My questions are:

Just how hard would a heart transplant be from my 3.0 to the S54 3.2?

Would I have any issues with electrics (ie light function, roof, steering)?

Would the engine slot straight in on the same mounting points?

Where would I stand with registering the vehicle in terms of the new engine?

Would I have issues with emissions at MOT time?

Are cars with upgraded engine transplants frowned upon by insurance companies or would it be treated as a standard ///M?

I wonder if @Lee , @GazHyde , @BMBabe or @Mnbrennan or anyone else could answer any of these questions?

 

[Dino D]

@Martyn Scott could probably shed some light, he knows a thing or 2 when it comes to the S54.

 

[Mnbrennan]

I should imagine it's not as easy as you'd first think.

The engine mounting point may be different as it will have come from a different chassis. The wiring loom will be different, including the ECU, cluster and other electronics.

Anything is possible, with enough time and/or money.

You would need to inform insurance and the DVLA.

Would be a very interesting project though!!

 

[Mac Romans]

I should imagine it's not as easy as you'd first think.

The engine mounting point may be different as it will have come from a different chassis. The wiring loom will be different, including the ECU, cluster and other electronics.

Anything is possible, with enough time and/or money.

You would need to inform insurance and the DVLA.

Would be a very interesting project though!!

Hmmm...it's something to think about. The wiring loom and possibly ECU will come with it along with the gearbox. He's offered me the lot for £2000 which is well below the going rate.

 

[Mnbrennan]

Hmmm...it's something to think about. The wiring loom and possibly ECU will come with it along with the gearbox. He's offered me the lot for £2000 which is well below the going rate.

That is a very good price...

 

[billz]

If you do this and things do not work then all you will need to do reference the Roof and other electrical components is probably get it reprogrammed. Their is the BMW Man in Heanor who is very good programming, i suspect as well he does home visits. You can get a read of what modules are on the car using the BMW Software and program them up individually.

 

[BMBabe]

Mate I wouldn't bother your Zed is awesome as it is

A standard insurer will not like this but I can insure it if you decide to do it

 

[Lee]

The mounts will be the same long as you get them from the S54 lump you will also need the ECU which I'm sure comes with the engine. It wouldn't be a huge challenge because the S54 is found in the Z4M so everything will fit. The only things I can see might the steering setup. In our z4's we have electric steering so that might be worth changing to hydraulic like the M's. Also the main prop shaft ask if you can have that too save you having to make one and get it balanced. Then obviously LSD bigger brakes all that jazz.

MOT time wouldn't be a problem just update your V5 to reflect the engine change along with the insurance.

That's all I can think of. I'm sure I read somewhere most bmw looms are compatible across the range long as they are around the same era.

Lee

 

[Mac Romans]

The mounts will be the same long as you get them from the S54 lump you will also need the ECU which I'm sure comes with the engine. It wouldn't be a huge challenge because the S54 is found in the Z4M so everything will fit. The only things I can see might the steering setup. In our z4's we have electric steering so that might be worth changing to hydraulic like the M's. Also the main prop shaft ask if you can have that too save you having to make one and get it balanced. Then obviously LSD bigger brakes all that jazz.

MOT time wouldn't be a problem just update your V5 to reflect the engine change along with the insurance.

That's all I can think of. I'm sure I read somewhere most bmw looms are compatible across the range long as they are around the same era.

Lee

Thanks for that. I've not asked about the prop shaft but I imagine I could have it as he'd need the one from the M5 anyway. Brakes eye have already been updated but steering could end up expensive. I'm gonna have to give this some serious thought I think. If I did do then the electric steering would be the only non ///M part if it worked.
By the time it's all done it will work out the same as buying an ///M from the start but mine looks so unique and I'm so used to it now I wouldn't want to go back to a standard looking one.

 

[Martyn Scott]

Thanks for that. I've not asked about the prop shaft but I imagine I could have it as he'd need the one from the M5 anyway. Brakes eye have already been updated but steering could end up expensive. I'm gonna have to give this some serious thought I think. If I did do then the electric steering would be the only non ///M part if it worked.
By the time it's all done it will work out the same as buying an ///M from the start but mine looks so unique and I'm so used to it now I wouldn't want to go back to a standard looking one.

It's not as easy as you think yes engine will just bolt straight in, but wiring looms are not inter changeable you will have to have the ECU done EWS taken out of the ECU and the engine wiring loom will have to be modded, just fitted an S54 into my E30 race car wiring and ECU will be your biggest cost around 1k which will also change it into 16 pin obd and get rid of the old 20 pin connector does affect anything else on the car as it's only the engine loom you need along with the ECU Prop and gerabox will be fine as long as your not changing them as well. would recommend LSD if you havnt got one and of course better brakes hope this helps have contacts for the loom and ECU if you need them

 

[MidlifeZ]

Hey Mac, the M5 ? not known for it's reliability mate, a friend of mine had one and lost a lot of money when it decided to throw it's bottom end, James at BMWMAN had it for months as a favour and in the end the finance company had it back and wrote off the debt.....His previous E39 M5 also swallowed up 10k of his hard earned cash on a bottom end rebuild.

 

[Jack Ratt]

I know 2 guys who bought M5's and both were money pits

 

[5harp3y]

M5 isnt the issue here

putting an M3 engine into a Z4 is! lol

Great info by @Martyn Scott

its probably well doable just costing it out will be important and worthw eighing up over buying a Z4M instead

 

[Mac Romans]

That's useful info @Martyn Scott. Thanks.
I'm not sure if I can factor in another £1000 on top of the cost of the engine and then the cost of the fitting/adaptation. Even getting the engine, gearbox and loom for £2k, the project will probably come in at about £5k and I'm not sure I can justify it.
If I could do it for under £4K I think it'd be worth it.

 

[Twin Turbo]

Well I am not shy of modding , but you going very much into unknown waters, I think this would be an ideal project if you could do the work yourself - However, if you planning in using an specialist to do the work - as said above this could be an real money pit.

If you wanting more power then I think Supercharger is the route to go

If its to shut up the ///M police (even if you did put this in - technically is not an ///M)

 

[Martyn Scott]

That's useful info @Martyn Scott. Thanks.
I'm not sure if I can factor in another £1000 on top of the cost of the engine and then the cost of the fitting/adaptation. Even getting the engine, gearbox and loom for £2k, the project will probably come in at about £5k and I'm not sure I can justify it.
If I could do it for under £4K I think it'd be worth it.

If your doing it your self i would say you shold be around the 4k mark.

 

[Mac Romans]

I haven't got the knowledge I'm afraid.

So....forced induction.....what sort of gains could I expect from a supercharger or a turbo?

 

[Twin Turbo]

Extra 80 - 100 Bhp

http://esstuning.com/ess-n51-52-vt1-supercharger-system-gen-2/

But its an known modification - quite a few peeps have done this

 

[Martyn Scott]

I haven't got the knowledge I'm afraid.

So....forced induction.....what sort of gains could I expect from a supercharger or a turbo?

Good gain with both really, Seen these engine go over 400 brake just not my cup of tea turbo cars brake too much.

 

[smiffy]

are the gains worth the effort?

would spending 4k on modding the 3.0ltr give a better end result?

will an engine change devalue the car more than modding will?

personally, i'd mod the existing.