ok ,had enough now..need help!..RESOLVED!

[joey]

Hi Zedonist,

I really don't have the expertise or the tools to undertake a head gasket myself..I could learn but I also have no garage so don't even have a place to work on it...I am hoping its just a hose..that would be great...


when I go down today I will look for oil in the water..water in the oil and white smoke on start up...but even a lack of those is not 100% indication of the had gasket being OK..it can be on its way and cause all manner of issues.

I will refill and start her up get to temp and try and track down the leak.



the hoses I can see look ok, but the leak is coming from somewhere I can't see directly either with the hood up or under the car(as far as I can get) I have no ramps or a jack...(wouldn't get under it jacked up anyway!)

the drips are coming from directly under the rad/fan area but as said before expansion tank is halfway full..until I can visualise the system fully like you guys can I can't make a diagnosis or even begin to look in the right place...


I am a very quick learner and far from helpless, I just need vey clear visual cues..hence my request for pics and or a clear diagram..


rain here so nothing will be done until it clears anyway..

 

[joey]

Hi Joey ,

Had a similar problem a few years back with my M44, turned out to be the radiator had split behind the expansion tank. The car was sat for 10mins ticking over, then all of a sudden steam everywhere.

I posted on a thread the other day where a fellow member had had similar issues, turned out to be the rad too. Let's hope this is a simple fix for you Joey.

If you fill the coolant system up with water does it empty quickly? Can you see where it is coming from?

Good luck.

Brian I haven't had a chance to do the refill tick over look for leak bit yet but am hoping it is something nice and simple..a rad would be fine with me as at least its a clear problem with a simple solution, and i can renew some rubber-work whilst its all out..

I am just concerned about another coolant leak days after the first overheat...i do not believe in coincidences!

fingers crossed its a simple fix with little cost attached.


thanks all for your advice..

 

[jonco]

Joey,

You need to work through the obvious visuals, as others have advised, and let's hope it's a simple one like a hose.
If you still feel it's the head gasket then an indy should be able to do a bubbler check fairly cheaply or you can buy the kit (ebay) and do it yourself - the test is easy enough.
Don't think of scrapping it - you could go and buy another with the same problem - they are all about 15 years old so it does become a lottery!

 

[joey]

fair enough all good and sensible points!.

it's difficult when you are in an area where you just don't have the knowledge to proceed and to be really confident in your conclusions, this could easily rack up a big bill at a garage as at present I can't drive it so they would have to come and get it.

and as today is rained off i'm sitting on my hands unable to investigate it myself..its sodden outside..

i'm sure it will be fine but historically problems on this car have come in clusters of two or three so i'm just a bit hacked off at this point...I have had a week of coolant problems and the associated expense and inconvenience.

interestingly I had bought a low mileage (46k) and well maintained car full and extensive history, but on reflection the thing about lady driver owned cars is they are serviced but not perhaps really looked after and gone into detail like an enthusiast owned car will have been.
and I think she just trusted her mechanic to do the job and didn't inspect anything and he has clearly missed things and performed a couple of dodgy repairs (the hose connector on the heater matrix hose being a perfect example) that he should have picked up or done properly.

I perhaps should have also looked more carefully under the hood, but its difficult when you are "learning on the job" I have largely been in the hands of friends family and you fine and upstanding gents

since owning the car I have replaced

windscreen washer pump £10

roof microswitch £5 and my time thanks to the wiki..

new tyres £600 (she had prestivo tyres very vague in the wet and prone to aquaplaning)

new wheels 16" z star in place of the 15" pepperpots. £120

front discs brakes and callipers due to a seized calliper that grooved the disc..cost around £450

wishbone bushes + labour £120

then rear window replaced £150

new thermostat and water pump £60 plus labour of around £100

acemans fantastic seat bushes £10 and 2 hours of my time..easily the best value fix i have done, so worth it.

short on rear light cluster chased and fixed and new (brighter) bulbs all round the car. £60

this is not including servicing....due to miles covered it has been done 3 times at around £120 a time inc parts and VAT..its also had new rear brake pads as well as a brake fluid change and new windscreen wipers on one the services.


now admittedly I have done 27k since purchase but the car without factoring in the cost of a new rad or god forbid a head gasket the car had cost me over £1000 in my first year of ownership..outside of servicing costs.

if I didn't have the forum to come to for advice the roof and washer pump alone would have been £500 at BMW.

she has also been a lot of fun but if another thing goes significantly wrong it will be sale time.....and replaced with a Saab 93..

 

[badman gee]

You have just been unlucky mate

 

[badman gee]

Very unlucky

 

[joey]

it would appear so!...

I love the car but it is beginning to wear me down...at what point do I just say enough..? another £200 down the line or more..?

I will fix this last thing but after that one more problem outside of the reasonable and she is gone.

my mate rob is having an even worse time with a renault espace I drove him down to devon to get..its been in the garage 4 times with various things wrong in the space of 3 months!

and he is normally lucky with cars..

 

[joey]

so gentlemen,

this is where the leak is finding its way to..its dripping from that point pictured,


at temp, steam is coming from around the expansion tank area and what looks like the maybe even the cap itself..either way its not a hose, I think its a blown rad and maybe a crack in the expansion tank that I can't see..an there is a steady drip of coolant coming from under the front of the car.

on the plus side the oil is not milky or frothy and there does not appear to be any steam coming from the exhaust.

however the idle is rougher than usual and on an M44 that is saying something.

so what are your thoughts on my diagnosis?

any other possibilities?

I will do a bubble test in the morning when the car has sat overnight.

cheers

J

 

[joey]

://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/c/BMW_Z3_1.9_1997/p/car-parts/car-cooling-parts-and-car-heating/cooling/car-radiator/?203110550&1&89972814e4cdc453da848bd09b27ba50d76f9097&000261

any good?

 

[zedonist]

Hi Joey,

I think that price is reasonable, I have looked at the other jobs you have done and they all seem normal Z problems, I think your issue has been cost of parts, I have done nearly all the same jobs, and not spent anywhere near £1000.

Like Jonco said these cars are between 10 and 18 years old, I was aware of this when I bought mine, and although there were better examples body wise, they were all tired in the same places and needed some work.

I think if you want a plug and play car then a Z3 is not for you, and I don't think a 2 - 3 k roadster of any type would be, you ideally want a 10k car, but the problem with these is they are more modern and more expensive to repair.

I would say stick with it on the cooling front it sounds like the rad and/or expansion bottle. With regards to the lumpy idle, it is an M44 trait, and worse running can be a sensor , vacuum, or injector seal problem. All these can be fixed in total for around £150.

After that there is not much else to go wrong.

Sorry to be blunt, but this is the cost of ownership, the good side is you won't have to do it for another 16 years.

 

[joey]

Fair enough ...All very reasonable comments.

I think it's just the fact things tend to go wrong in little clusters..It can be frustrating and unlike some of you guys I don't have the expertise to diagnose and fix the problem myself.

However that won't be the case as time goes on as I'm learning so much from getting under the hood and building up a nice little set of tools

Barry Gadd just lives down the road from me and is coming over Thursday to help me fit the new rad and I'm going to help with his seat bushes

so Zroadster.org to the rescue once again!

I always thought the first year could be tricky as things could come to the surface.

In perspective 27k in a 16 yr old car in a year...There were bound to be a couple of issues!

Will keep you all posted. .

 

[Brian H]

Joey,

Changing a radiator is fairly straight forward, just remember when bleeding the system to have the heater on full. One of the trickiest bits is getting the viscous fan off, ideally you need a suitable spanner for the viscous fan and a tool to hold the pulley still.

Good luck

 

[joey]

Thanks Brian

Will do all of that.

I have help and Barry did his last week so I assume he has a suitable tool for the fan..

I'm confident it will go smoothly and will then look at the areas mentioned by Zedonist in the next service, cam sensor ,vacuum hoses and Injector seals.

I will also replace the coolant hoses for silicone ones around sept time and budget for a new cat and exhaust in the next few months..

Then job done, tip top car on my hands.

 

[t-tony]

You don't have to do it all at once Joe. Let some things come to you and then it wont be so overwhelming mate.
I did a lot of work on my 2000 car last year but up to now, touch wood, this year has been trouble free.
Stick with it mate, you know it's worth it.

 

[GazHyde]

Hey @joey... If I can change a radiator, then you will have no problems

 

[joey]

You are all right..

It is to be expected and it's definitely worth it..

Have been driving the wife's civic and it's a stark contrast !

Not to mention that my Z has become a part of my persona ..like my favourite telecaster or Del boys yellow van...

I just get annoyed when I can't get in and drive because it makes every journey such a pleasure in a way the civic just can't or most other cars I have driven TBH.

If anything this trouble has highlighted how much I love the car and that with the amount of driving I do for work it HAS to be enjoyable.

Roll on Thursday and I can get her back on the road..!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-Z3-1-...-Spec-Blade-/231260607753?pt=UK_CarsParts_Veh

that's the fan I am going to fit made by Febi, decided to do it whilst i'm in there..seems silly not to.

and this is the rad..http://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/c/B...d-car-heating/cooling/car-radiator/?203110550

so have managed to source the parts at a great price and the fitting will done by myself and Barry.

p.s me and Barry had a nice chat on the phone and I can say he is a really nice bloke, it's another example of the comradery on the forum, that I have to say is unmatched and unusual on the web and is nice to have a fellow Z'r just around the corner.

even though I haven't met anyone in person I feel like I have a good sense of everyones character from Badmans no nonsense sense of humour to Gaz's affable reasonableness..to many to mention but almost all have pitched in to help and offer advice not just to me but to anyone who has required it.

its quite lovely, and sadly unusual in these times.


gush over, I have a Z to fix!


J

 

[joey]

update....

its been an enjoyable day working on the car but not with the outcome I would have liked!..

plus as the car is an auto there were some unexpected surprises,like having to disconnect the transmission hoses to remove the rad from the car..then those O rings needed replacing so down to vines of guildford and the outrageous cost of £ 1.61..

replaced the rad and all seemed well at first but once up to temp and driving up the road the leak re-appeared along with the overheat...

on closer inspection it looked like the steam and leak was coming from the radiator cap..! it was very hard to see exactly where from originally so I had concluded expansion tank or rad..

it seems I may not have been right..and have remove a perfectly good rad for no reason...it was fun though and at £50 well worth it!
another job done..

so in the morning I will top up the coolant and bleed the system again and try with one of the two rad caps Barry had spare.

having inspected mine there is a nick in one of the O rings and the other one I have has springier and fresher rubber.


fingers crossed this is the cause because if not I am clearly in head gasket territory..

Barry turned out to be just as nice as he sounded on the phone and has been a top bloke today, so a public thanks and thumbs up to him for all the help,

any other suggestions on what it could be much appreciated at this point as its getting a little strange!

 

[Mint]

It sounds like you're becoming an expert yourself Joey. I hope a new radiator cap is all that is needed. Good luck tomorrow

 

[joey]

thanks mint..me too!

but I suspect head gasket if i'm really honest..

no worries though it it turns out to be this I will tackle it myself..!

 

[Mint]

PMA - it will be the rad cap...